Is this forum dying?

[Gitsnik]

Theres a great attitude, wonder why people arent posting as much? I know for a lot of well versed people the noobs and noob questions are annoying but why not be patient with them? The only reason they are noobs is because nobody has taught them. Not everyone can read a book and pick up the concept. I know Mitnick wasnt born with the skills, he was trained as a communications specialist by telecom companies and then learned about computers. Auto-ban? Really? Thats going to solve your issue of growing your forum lol. I understand you people arent PR, but jesus guys, havent you heard of common decency?

It's not really that they're noobs that's the problem. There are a number of people on these forums and others that get help directly from so called "senior members". The problem is a lack of comprehension at the most basic level. The beginners section, for example, expressly points out that this forum is related to backtrack, not general Linux. It's right there at the top of the beginners section, but nobody reads it. By the same token, people are told to search, but apparently nobody does.

For those that can't pick up a book, there are courses available. Free and otherwise. There are free CTF games, free web hacking environments and downloads, and a whole plethora of free videos and tutorials - many made by the more pleasant members of this forum (g0tmi1k for example). Or you can pay for them, the remote-exploit team do some seriously good work, and many experienced professionals will recommend them highly (myself included).

But really, the biggest problem I've seen from the get go, has been the expectation that the people who are here, and who do help, should be answering immediately and with the total answer. People get annoyed when they are told to try harder, google it, or read the manual. It's not like the information isn't out there as I pointed out above, but every few months we get a "the senior members are bastards" or "this forum is dead" thread. Which is where my comment came from - nobody is paying us to be here, so you are getting what you pay for. If you want a linux basics course, you can find them everywhere. If you want the personal touch, I charge $400AU an hour

I've heard of common decency. If I wanted to be commonly decent to everyone I would go work in a call center.

[thorin]

I've heard of common decency. If I wanted to be commonly decent to everyone I would go work in a call center.

DON'T DO IT. Headshrinkers charge more than $400AU an hour

[Barry]

Barry I couldnt agree more--but please think about this:

The newbies are the main posters of this forum. The leet members arent posting all the time. They dont need help with backtrack, usually they can figure it out--and when they can't its such an advanced post that only certain people typically answer. Its the noobs that are going to keep this place active. If you drive away all the newbies, then what do you have left? A: You have leet members who dont need to post, because they dont need the help. Unless they make a program, toolkit, or have something brand new to bring to the table. If not then there is no point in posting.

Do you concur?

I'm not saying drive them out. Just make them use the damn search button.

[Bl4cks4b3r]

I'm not saying drive them out. Just make them use the damn search button.

Fair enough.

To Gitsnick:

I agree, I just dont like when people are so hard on the noobs. Some day we will be gone, or too busy, or life will simply happen. In order to continue new people--"newbies"-- need to emerge. I just dont like when the new crowd (who may be horrible bland, unskilled, and ill informed) TRY to learn and get banned, or get flamed out. Understand that a lot of these noobs look up to the big names, and to the people on this forum, and its discouraging when they get the hammer dropped on them. Thats why I posted a long time ago that if someone is a complete newbie, just send them to my forum, Ill take the time to spoon feed them until they can post here.

[shadowzero]

Good to see I'm not the only one having problems logging into the site. For some reason I thought this was fixed already? Seems I can only login now using Incognito mode... and sometimes not even.

Anyways, perhaps this is too much for newbies to read, but maybe still something that should be recommended to users before they post: http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

[Barry]

I've been trying to get the mods to put a flashing banner at the top of the page that says "Use the Search Button!" for years....

[VulpiArgenti]

problems logging into the site. For some reason I thought this was fixed already

Still can take me days to log in, although I've just noticed clearing cookies first seems to work.

[zimmaro]

Still can take me days to log in, although I've just noticed clearing cookies first seems to work.

good!!
thanks vulpiargenti for the ""starboard""
I just cleaned the cookies in my firefox 15 and I immediately logged-on the first try!
miracle!

[thorin]

I've been trying to get the mods to put a flashing banner at the top of the page that says "Use the Search Button!" for years....

Oh no.......the return of the blink tag

As for my reply to the OP...."try searching", this topic comes up regularly i.e. http://www.backtrack-linux.org/forum...ad.php?t=50419 (06/2012)

This thread has a good analogy for newbs and use (or lack thereof) of the search button: http://www.backtrack-linux.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2155

[ShadowMaster]

I thought I would throw in here.
As for the problem of experts not posting unless its a new tool or whatever, this is because they are sick of the "Why is my forged ARP packet not generating traffic?" when the attacker has forgotten to actually inject it. I have answered questions like that, then I just gave up. Someone who has an actual problem, question, riddle, or idea related to *HACKING* would be answered very very quickly. As many posters have been saying before, learn linux, and learn the search button. My first ever post landed me an infraction for double/cross posting. After that, I learned how to search. As for comaX's script issue (noobs asking how to run), I concur and agree wholeheartedly. For several reasons in fact. It's an advanced script. Says so right there. PWNSoft by vulpi argenti (sp?) says this script is not to be used by people who can't use it. That leaves the more advanced users to ask and input intelligent questions. I my self am writing an ASM ghostwriter and took the risk of alienating n00bs in my OP about it by saying this is for people who appreciate hacking and do not want to zOMG h4x0r. The script is an advanced script for *SHELLCODERS*. I did not want to get questions about why the decompiled meterpreter payload fails. If you have to ask that, the script is not for you. These are posted in the experts section for a reason. And you know what. Every response to my script has helped advance it. I feel the alienation was worth it, but I may be wrong of course. It was a conscious decision that I do not regret.

As for the test, it would not be practical, because people would post the answers, n00bs would google them, and we would be right back to where we started.

I do think however, that there should be some sort of fencing off of the linux and *BASIC* questions. More forums for them perhaps? with more advanced BT members as moderators?

A final thought. I happen to be OSWP and OSCP, and am working on OSCE. While the knowledge contained within those course has *TREMENDOUSLY* advanced my skill in all areas, I still find myself asking n00b questions on certain subjects. Not everyone can know everything. People will always need help. But instead of asking in the forums, maybe join the irc server at freenode with X-CHAT, x-chat 2, hexchat, irssi or any other IRC client and join channels like #backtrack-linux , #offtopicsec , #corelan , #metasploit , #hacktalk , #intern0t , and many many others that have people who are able and willing to help. The response is usually quicker and the people usually work with you if you take the time and appreciate their help. And always remember the primary rules of IRC: Watch your language and *ASK* *BEFORE* *A* *PM*!!