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Thread: Firewall penetration testing

  1. #1
    Just burned his ISO
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    Default Firewall penetration testing

    Hello all. I am fairly new to BackTrack and this is my first post in these forums. I've played with BackTrack a little but never really got too in depth with it for any serious hacking.

    Here's the situation that I have: I'm taking a class called Managing Network Environments and we are supposed to set up a full, functioning network with multiple domains and domain controllers, commercial grade routers, switches, and firewalls, user and object accounts, email servers, etc. My instructor asked if I would be willing to test the strength of our firewalls to see how well my classmates have set it up. He wants me to keep it quiet so it would represent a realistic network attack.

    So I'm wondering if there's anyone here that might be able to give me some advice on getting started with this task. I imagine (but am not too sure) that BackTrack will have the right tools for this task. I'm using the latest BT4 Final distro on a bootable USB drive. I've tried searching for something along these lines but have been unsuccessful so far.The firewalls that we are using are Cisco PIX515E and we have one firewall between the internet and the DMZ and another firewall between the DMZ and the network. I'm hoping that there is a way I can try to get through both firewalls to really test the strength of our setup.

    Any help would be greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
    Junior Member skidmarq's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Since it is for class, do you care about noise? If not, just start with a simple TCP/UDP port scan using your favorite scanner and modify your attack tree strategy based on what ports you find open....

  3. #3
    Moderator fancy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    I just wonder why teachers/instructors/friends etc. always choose people for a "job" like this who have not the slightest idea/clue/imagination about what they are doing or what they should do.............

  4. #4
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Quote Originally Posted by fancy View Post
    I just wonder why teachers/instructors/friends etc. always choose people for a "job" like this who have not the slightest idea/clue/imagination about what they are doing or what they should do.............
    Funny, I was wondering how many more of these moronic "my teacher asked me to do something I'm incapable of, and no training for, and have no idea how to go about" before the end of the year. Maybe we could start a pool... Better yet, maybe the pool should be "how many of these stories do we get before the mods get so sick of them the just automatically ban the posting member?"

    By the way, a point to show I'm just not talking smack: Myself and some other pen testers were assisted a local college last month to help do this type of thing. The students had set up a lab, and we evaluated the security of it. The course instructor didn't ask students to do something that they had no clue how to go about doing, he asked people with the knowledge, training, and tools to come in as independent reviewers to check the students' work. That's what happens in real life.
    Thorn
    Stop the TSA now! Boycott the airlines.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Between here and IRC I hear this story almost daily. Sometimes I delete them and sometimes I let a few through just in the small hope that someone new will actually read some one else's post on the subject and realize how ridiculous it sounds. My experience on the subject is sort of the opposite of Thorns. I went to a "Technical" school to get a degree. I would also venture to say that I had better linux/security/network skills that 95% of the instructors in the school. They were even aware of this and asked me to teach a few "breaking WEP" demos. What they did not ever do is ask me to attack any school machines and they never asked me to test the integrity of any of the server infrastructures we set up. The fact of the matter is that I was a student and they were the teachers and this type of thing is just not done. It even sounds ridiculous to say, okay class I want you to build a entire network and then test its security. Then give your self a grade. Well heck, I'll say my network is perfect and give my self a A+ every time.

  6. #6
    Just burned his ISO
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Quote Originally Posted by skidmarq View Post
    Since it is for class, do you care about noise? If not, just start with a simple TCP/UDP port scan using your favorite scanner and modify your attack tree strategy based on what ports you find open....
    Thanks for the advice.

    As for the rest of the comments, thanks for using your time wisely to ridicule me and what I was asked to do. It's extremely helpful to be reminded that I'm learning how to use something and to be told what an idiot I am for asking the question in the first place.

  7. #7
    Super Moderator Archangel-Amael's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Quote Originally Posted by tlingitsoldier View Post
    Thanks for the advice.

    As for the rest of the comments, thanks for using your time wisely to ridicule me and what I was asked to do. It's extremely helpful to be reminded that I'm learning how to use something and to be told what an idiot I am for asking the question in the first place.


    Actually no one called you an idiot or otherwise. They did however (much as I will ) criticize your above story. No one really believes it,
    one of the above posters doesn't even live in the US and has a different education background than one would find in the US and doesn't believe the story, so that in and of itself means something. While we are all for your learning, we won't spoon feed you nor will we easily believe stories that we have all heard many times before.
    Furthermore you did receive a valid answer in the second post.
    But a better question than yours would be to ask your teacher what you should do, since you are there to learn and you obviously have no idea what you are doing.
    I mean you or someone is probably paying for you to go there, and get an education. Oh and part of getting said education is somewhere along the lines a bit on how to research.
    Same applies here.


    One more word to the wise; don't bite the hand that feeds you. Here it's not a suggestion.
    Last edited by Archangel-Amael; 04-27-2010 at 05:36 PM.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Quote Originally Posted by tlingitsoldier View Post
    .... we have one firewall between the internet and the DMZ and another firewall between the DMZ and the network. I'm hoping that there is a way I can try to get through both firewalls to really test the strength of our setup.
    I might be reading this wrong, but if your goal is go through both firewalls (more specifically the internet one) you might also be going against your ISP's ToS when preforming attacks. Might want to check their rules first before trying anything remotely.

    There's a couple of posts in the archive forum that might be of interest to you, try searching them out in the forum. Just use the same keywords in your search, "firewall, audit, testing" etc.

    Also I agree with what everyone else is saying. Not that your intentions maybe malicious, but something doesn't sound kosher. Good luck.
    Last edited by Lincoln; 04-27-2010 at 05:54 PM.

  9. #9
    My life is this forum thorin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Quote Originally Posted by tlingitsoldier View Post
    Hello all. I am fairly new to BackTrack and this is my first post in these forums. I've played with BackTrack a little but never really got too in depth with it for any serious hacking.

    Here's the situation that I have: I'm taking a class called Managing Network Environments and we are supposed to set up a full, functioning network with multiple domains and domain controllers, commercial grade routers, switches, and firewalls, user and object accounts, email servers, etc. My instructor asked if I would be willing to test the strength of our firewalls to see how well my classmates have set it up. He wants me to keep it quiet so it would represent a realistic network attack.
    One would hope that your instructor is knowledgeable enough to know the answer to this before starting. Further if he wants it to be "a realistic network attack" he should hire someone that actually does this for a living, not some random kid in his class who knows nothing about security testing.

    So I'm wondering if there's anyone here that might be able to give me some advice on getting started with this task.
    Tell him to hire someone if he doesn't have the necessary knowledge/skills. Then go to his boss(es) and say "WTF is this guy teaching this course for if he can't figure out if what he's teaching us has any real world applicability?" Then go to the administration and tell them you want your money back.
    I'm a compulsive post editor, you might wanna wait until my post has been online for 5-10 mins before quoting it as it will likely change.

    I know I seem harsh in some of my replies. SORRY! But if you're doing something illegal or posting something that seems to be obvious BS I'm going to call you on it.

  10. #10
    Super Moderator Archangel-Amael's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firewall penetration testing

    Quote Originally Posted by thorin View Post
    Then go to his boss(es) and say "WTF is this guy teaching this course for if he can't figure out if what he's teaching us has any real world applicability?"
    Of course many of us probably did say the same things about our professors.

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